You commented on my abortion post and I found your questions to be so darn interesting, I decided to devote an entire post to them so that everyone who comes across this can read and respond if they want to.
I've put your questions in italic red, Lacy, to emphasize how special they are. I think either caffeine, alcohol, or leftover spaghetti will be required to attain comfort while muddling through it all for everyone else.
Love always,
AP
May I ask how your son was conceived if you're a lesbian?
Sure. Some faggot I know jacked off in a dixie cup and my girlfriend used a turkey baster on me. Woot, good times!
Okay, that's a lie but wasn't it fun to read? Far more truthfully, I was married to his father and we had Jake. I married his father because I love him and yes, that's present tense love, even though we're divorced. Oh, and both (natural) conception and birth occurred after the marriage. Go figure, huh? :-)
Leviticus 18:22 "Do not lie with a man as one lies with a woman it is an abomination"
Thanks! So, have you ever really researched the history of Leviticus 18:22, Lacy? Or do you just read it, not care about the context, and run with it? First off, if we're going to be literal and not worry over context, apparently the problem is only with gay men and not gay women. *grins* But I like understanding the entire history of a Bible quote. Leviticus is part of The Old Testament and the Old Testament was God's instructions to Jews only. A covenant between God and the state of Israel. No one else. Period. That's sort of important, isn't it? So, now we're down to it speaking only of gay Jewish men. Oh, that's not going to work for you, is it? Okay, let's look at more of the background of the Old Testament Leviticus, shall we? At that time, women were considered property of men so for a man to lie with a man would be insulting to the man being laid. That was a problem. Not the homosexual act, but the insult of equating another man as being chattle. Oopsie-daisy.
Going back to the actual history of Leviticus, though, it was written by self-exiled Jews who came back to Israel and, as punishment, had to rebuild a temple for some king whose name is lost in my mind. All well and fine, but these same Jews had also practiced pagan rites that the Canaanites did in the land they'd exiled themselves to prior to the temple-building. So, in simple terms, Leviticus advocates pagan rituals receive death for certain acts. It has nothing to do with homosexuality and everything to do with Jews taking part in pagan acts, which included straight people having ritual sex with members of their sex. That's very, very different to homosexuality. Did you know that in the Old Testament, too, people were also put to death for picking up sticks on the Sabbath. I guess, at this point, the only question to ask you, Lacy, is this: Are you saying pagan rituals prove what God wants? 'Cause that's a little bit worrisome for you and amusing for me.
Leviticus 20:13 "If a man lies with a man as one lies with a woman both them have done what is detestable. They be put to death"
Same as above.
"Because of this, God gave them over to shameful lusts. Even their women exchanged natural relations for unnatural ones. In the same way the men also abandoned natural relations with women and were inflamed with lust for one another. Men committed indecent acts with other men, and received in themselves the due penalty for their perversion".
Oh, better job, Lacy! We're into the King James version now and that includes Gentiles, too. Paul said this, you know. Paul is a little bit of a nut, but that's alright, I can appreciate it. ;-) However, you do have to remember that the New Testament is comprised of letters from man to man, and doesn't pretend to be otherwise, doesn't pretend to be the word of God, except for Acts and the four Gospels, none of which contain this particular verse. So, even the Bible owns this is a personal belief and not the word of God. Still, I'll play along because I like you. See where it says "Because of this"? Did you wonder to yourself, "Because of *what?" before you posted this? You should have. "This" refers to the fact that your quote is part of a letter Paul wrote to the church and in it, he is addressing pagan rituals. The *heterosexual people were engaging in homosexual acts as part of the their lapse into pagan rituals. He is referring to straight people who are going against their nature here, not gay people going against their nature. Bet you never knew that, did you?
1 Corinthians 6:9 "Do you not know the wicked will not inherit the Kingdom of God? Do not be deceived; Neither the sexually immoral nor idolaters not adulterers nor male prostitutes nor homosexuals..."
Again, written by Paul to others, and not the word of God. That aside, I still sort of like Paul but man, he had a fear of pagans, didn't he? Anyway, Paul's words, untranslated, used the word "malakoi" to refer to what you are now calling gay people. Did you know about this? It's pretty cool. In both Matthew (I'm pretty sure but could be wrong) and Luke, "malakoi" is also used to refer to cloth that is soft and pliable. Accurate translations of the language at the time Paul wrote this point to the word actually meaning people who are soft, lazy, and cowardly, with no homosexual connotations at all. The word "malakoi", which Paul used when he wrote this in his native tongue, far more accurately points to those guilty of sloth...one of the seven deadly sins. Only in modern times has it come to mean homosexuals. Isn't that darn interesting? Yeah, me too. :-)
Lets not forget about Sodom and Gomorrah.
Well, no. Never. Those were some wild places, weren't they? Of course, again, only in modern translation have they become about homosexuality. In Biblical times, the problem with Sodom and Gomorrah wasn't homosexuality. It was sin in general. Have you ever read Ezekial? It's cool, good readin'. Ezekial 16:49 says "Behold, this was the guilt of your sister Sodom: she and her daughters had arrogance, abundant food and careless ease, but she did not help the poor and needy." Ezekial 16:50 says "Thus they were haughty and committed abominations before Me Therefore I removed them when I saw it." Funny, homosexuality is never mentioned as a problem in Sodom here. Now, considering the pagan ritualistic roots, I'm the first to admit it was probably happening, as was rape, but never is it mentioned that it was happening among gay people. Only heterosexual people and that's what made it so awful. All those straight people were going against the "nature" God gave them. I don't blame God for being a little pissy about that. But oh, Lacy, I know what you're thinking now! You picked up on that "committed abominations before me" and just know they're talking about gay people there, didn't you? Well, if you head on off to Proverbs 6:16-19, you'll find a list of things God has His biggest issues with, and that means abominations. "These six things doth the LORD hate: yea, seven are an abomination unto him: 'A proud look, a lying tongue, and hands that shed innocent blood, a heart that deviseth wicked imaginations, feet that be swift in running to mischief, a false witness that speaketh lies, and he that soweth discord among brethren.'" I guess He just forgot to mention homosexuals. Or do we sow discord among brethren? Is that it? By the way, my own thoughts here...in many passages people deem to be anti-homosexual, it refers to people going after strange flesh. Were those gay people, would they not be going after *same flesh? But hey, don't mind me...I'm just pondering as I type.
Now show me where in the Bible it says that I'm immoral for treating a medical condition that causes my ovaries to have cysts all around them?
I hate to break it to you, but you aren't mentioned in the Bible, Lacy. Neither are your ovaries. That bit of news broken, the story of Abraham and Sarah is interesting. God controlled the fact they were unable to bear children together as evidenced by the fact the He, and He alone, then changed His mind and gave them Isaac. And not as a result of medical interference, either. Of course, now *I'm using the Old Testament, so maybe this only applies to Jews. Oh, and let's not forget Hannah (in Samuel, I think?) who begged God for a baby but was accused of being drunk. That got ugly. But in the end, it was again God, and God alone, who made the decision, based on her pleading, to give her...um...Samuel? Never is a mention made of barren women attaining medical intervention to conceive. Nev-er. Only God's intervention. Now, if you really want me to make a post giving Biblical quotes showing that God is all-powerful and makes no mistakes, I will but I predict it will be more lengthy than this one. That could be bad.
You know I can promise you one thing, you will never, ever see me post on a public blog calling my son as "asshole" and a "fucktard". Mother of the year right there. *snickers*
Ummm, the snicker has me confounded, but okay. Good for you? For the record, I've never claimed to be mother of the year. In fact, I'll tell you all day long that I am not. You know why I'm not? Well, aside from calling my kid a fucktard, there is no real mother of the year thing. It's pretty much just a saying and a few random internet sites have run with it. Apparently, though, you were bothered by the fact I'll call Jake names. I'll grant you, Lacy, we don't live a typical life, nor have I parented in a typical manner, I suppose. Our rule is that we can call one another names in anger (or jest) to others, to vent, but never to one another's faces and never, ever do we call other people fucktards to their faces. Oh, that would be bad. Tacky. If he read that I called him a fucktard, though, he'd crack up and ask what he'd done to tick me off that day. Same with me. It works for us. We love each other. And really, you don't need to promise me anything. Heck, I don't even know you, even though you amuse me. :-)
I do want to thank the Academy and Lacy for the opportunity to make this post. I've enjoyed it thoroughly and can't want to see what comments it may bring. Lacy, we might need to hire caterers and have an open bar. Can you chip in?
Sure. Some faggot I know jacked off in a dixie cup and my girlfriend used a turkey baster on me. Woot, good times!
Okay, that's a lie but wasn't it fun to read? Far more truthfully, I was married to his father and we had Jake. I married his father because I love him and yes, that's present tense love, even though we're divorced. Oh, and both (natural) conception and birth occurred after the marriage. Go figure, huh? :-)
Leviticus 18:22 "Do not lie with a man as one lies with a woman it is an abomination"
Thanks! So, have you ever really researched the history of Leviticus 18:22, Lacy? Or do you just read it, not care about the context, and run with it? First off, if we're going to be literal and not worry over context, apparently the problem is only with gay men and not gay women. *grins* But I like understanding the entire history of a Bible quote. Leviticus is part of The Old Testament and the Old Testament was God's instructions to Jews only. A covenant between God and the state of Israel. No one else. Period. That's sort of important, isn't it? So, now we're down to it speaking only of gay Jewish men. Oh, that's not going to work for you, is it? Okay, let's look at more of the background of the Old Testament Leviticus, shall we? At that time, women were considered property of men so for a man to lie with a man would be insulting to the man being laid. That was a problem. Not the homosexual act, but the insult of equating another man as being chattle. Oopsie-daisy.
Going back to the actual history of Leviticus, though, it was written by self-exiled Jews who came back to Israel and, as punishment, had to rebuild a temple for some king whose name is lost in my mind. All well and fine, but these same Jews had also practiced pagan rites that the Canaanites did in the land they'd exiled themselves to prior to the temple-building. So, in simple terms, Leviticus advocates pagan rituals receive death for certain acts. It has nothing to do with homosexuality and everything to do with Jews taking part in pagan acts, which included straight people having ritual sex with members of their sex. That's very, very different to homosexuality. Did you know that in the Old Testament, too, people were also put to death for picking up sticks on the Sabbath. I guess, at this point, the only question to ask you, Lacy, is this: Are you saying pagan rituals prove what God wants? 'Cause that's a little bit worrisome for you and amusing for me.
Leviticus 20:13 "If a man lies with a man as one lies with a woman both them have done what is detestable. They be put to death"
Same as above.
"Because of this, God gave them over to shameful lusts. Even their women exchanged natural relations for unnatural ones. In the same way the men also abandoned natural relations with women and were inflamed with lust for one another. Men committed indecent acts with other men, and received in themselves the due penalty for their perversion".
Oh, better job, Lacy! We're into the King James version now and that includes Gentiles, too. Paul said this, you know. Paul is a little bit of a nut, but that's alright, I can appreciate it. ;-) However, you do have to remember that the New Testament is comprised of letters from man to man, and doesn't pretend to be otherwise, doesn't pretend to be the word of God, except for Acts and the four Gospels, none of which contain this particular verse. So, even the Bible owns this is a personal belief and not the word of God. Still, I'll play along because I like you. See where it says "Because of this"? Did you wonder to yourself, "Because of *what?" before you posted this? You should have. "This" refers to the fact that your quote is part of a letter Paul wrote to the church and in it, he is addressing pagan rituals. The *heterosexual people were engaging in homosexual acts as part of the their lapse into pagan rituals. He is referring to straight people who are going against their nature here, not gay people going against their nature. Bet you never knew that, did you?
1 Corinthians 6:9 "Do you not know the wicked will not inherit the Kingdom of God? Do not be deceived; Neither the sexually immoral nor idolaters not adulterers nor male prostitutes nor homosexuals..."
Again, written by Paul to others, and not the word of God. That aside, I still sort of like Paul but man, he had a fear of pagans, didn't he? Anyway, Paul's words, untranslated, used the word "malakoi" to refer to what you are now calling gay people. Did you know about this? It's pretty cool. In both Matthew (I'm pretty sure but could be wrong) and Luke, "malakoi" is also used to refer to cloth that is soft and pliable. Accurate translations of the language at the time Paul wrote this point to the word actually meaning people who are soft, lazy, and cowardly, with no homosexual connotations at all. The word "malakoi", which Paul used when he wrote this in his native tongue, far more accurately points to those guilty of sloth...one of the seven deadly sins. Only in modern times has it come to mean homosexuals. Isn't that darn interesting? Yeah, me too. :-)
Lets not forget about Sodom and Gomorrah.
Well, no. Never. Those were some wild places, weren't they? Of course, again, only in modern translation have they become about homosexuality. In Biblical times, the problem with Sodom and Gomorrah wasn't homosexuality. It was sin in general. Have you ever read Ezekial? It's cool, good readin'. Ezekial 16:49 says "Behold, this was the guilt of your sister Sodom: she and her daughters had arrogance, abundant food and careless ease, but she did not help the poor and needy." Ezekial 16:50 says "Thus they were haughty and committed abominations before Me Therefore I removed them when I saw it." Funny, homosexuality is never mentioned as a problem in Sodom here. Now, considering the pagan ritualistic roots, I'm the first to admit it was probably happening, as was rape, but never is it mentioned that it was happening among gay people. Only heterosexual people and that's what made it so awful. All those straight people were going against the "nature" God gave them. I don't blame God for being a little pissy about that. But oh, Lacy, I know what you're thinking now! You picked up on that "committed abominations before me" and just know they're talking about gay people there, didn't you? Well, if you head on off to Proverbs 6:16-19, you'll find a list of things God has His biggest issues with, and that means abominations. "These six things doth the LORD hate: yea, seven are an abomination unto him: 'A proud look, a lying tongue, and hands that shed innocent blood, a heart that deviseth wicked imaginations, feet that be swift in running to mischief, a false witness that speaketh lies, and he that soweth discord among brethren.'" I guess He just forgot to mention homosexuals. Or do we sow discord among brethren? Is that it? By the way, my own thoughts here...in many passages people deem to be anti-homosexual, it refers to people going after strange flesh. Were those gay people, would they not be going after *same flesh? But hey, don't mind me...I'm just pondering as I type.
Now show me where in the Bible it says that I'm immoral for treating a medical condition that causes my ovaries to have cysts all around them?
I hate to break it to you, but you aren't mentioned in the Bible, Lacy. Neither are your ovaries. That bit of news broken, the story of Abraham and Sarah is interesting. God controlled the fact they were unable to bear children together as evidenced by the fact the He, and He alone, then changed His mind and gave them Isaac. And not as a result of medical interference, either. Of course, now *I'm using the Old Testament, so maybe this only applies to Jews. Oh, and let's not forget Hannah (in Samuel, I think?) who begged God for a baby but was accused of being drunk. That got ugly. But in the end, it was again God, and God alone, who made the decision, based on her pleading, to give her...um...Samuel? Never is a mention made of barren women attaining medical intervention to conceive. Nev-er. Only God's intervention. Now, if you really want me to make a post giving Biblical quotes showing that God is all-powerful and makes no mistakes, I will but I predict it will be more lengthy than this one. That could be bad.
You know I can promise you one thing, you will never, ever see me post on a public blog calling my son as "asshole" and a "fucktard". Mother of the year right there. *snickers*
Ummm, the snicker has me confounded, but okay. Good for you? For the record, I've never claimed to be mother of the year. In fact, I'll tell you all day long that I am not. You know why I'm not? Well, aside from calling my kid a fucktard, there is no real mother of the year thing. It's pretty much just a saying and a few random internet sites have run with it. Apparently, though, you were bothered by the fact I'll call Jake names. I'll grant you, Lacy, we don't live a typical life, nor have I parented in a typical manner, I suppose. Our rule is that we can call one another names in anger (or jest) to others, to vent, but never to one another's faces and never, ever do we call other people fucktards to their faces. Oh, that would be bad. Tacky. If he read that I called him a fucktard, though, he'd crack up and ask what he'd done to tick me off that day. Same with me. It works for us. We love each other. And really, you don't need to promise me anything. Heck, I don't even know you, even though you amuse me. :-)
I do want to thank the Academy and Lacy for the opportunity to make this post. I've enjoyed it thoroughly and can't want to see what comments it may bring. Lacy, we might need to hire caterers and have an open bar. Can you chip in?
XOXOXOX,
AP
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15 comments:
AP - You are my hero!!!!
Remind me never to...
1. Argue the bible with you (not that I would since I haven't read it)
2. Ever piss you off.
3. Leave a stupid remark on your blog.
Woman, you rock and I seriously missed you today.
I enjoyed reading that. Can I call you my hero?
Never call me your hero, Dawn, please. Must I reference my post on heroes here? ;-) But you can call me a fucktard or your friend any time. I'd be honored with either. And thank you!
I love it! I want to cross-stitch it and hang it on my wall. I don't always agree with your opinions on other matters but at least you get me to dust off the cobwebs of my mind and assess my convictions.
By the way, did you ever comment on the DISI board on AOL? I used to roam those parts about 10 years ago.
Bravo! Bravo! Excellent post.
"Some faggot I know jacked off in a dixie cup and my girlfriend used a turkey baster on me. Woot, good times!"
Lmao!!
Don't think i'll be using my turkey baster this year. Maybe never again. LMAO
Oh snap! Lacy you just got played!
great post AP!
Good grief, Lisa, warn a person that kind of thinking is going to be involved. You know me and my background and you know I'll have to go back and re-read this when I can think. Very, very interesting. And funny as hell, as usual. ;-D (P.S. I also threw away my turkey baster.)
Aww, thanks everyone! How funny is it that no one has tried to prove me wrong? I tend to be an overachiever when I put my mind to something...it would be grand fun if they at least tried. And where the heck is Lacy?
great post!
my goodness...why do people have such a hard time understanding that OUR God is all loving. one who would be pleased to see His children happy in any all loving and all respecting relationship. this goes for sexual preference and racial preference, etc.
love is the answer to everything. and i can't wait for the day that we ALL learn the truth.
Loved this post!
In another matter - how do I find your email to ask for an invite to whatever it is I was asked to be invited to? LOL I'm confused!!
Thanks to everyone who replied to this but I'm so very sorry Lacy never did. I find it funny this entry got hundreds of hits...far more than any other one I've made, yet no one argued that I am wrong. If I made even one person stop and think, read their Bible *backwards, then I'm a happy girl. :-)
AP
I read this the other night and then got distracted and forgot to comment. LOVE IT! I just bet Lacy never came back! What could she say???
Good choices of scripture. And dont they always ask the same line of questions....ya think they teach it in their sunday schools?
I am with you.....hope it makes some folks open their eyes and think! And it sheds a whole new light on the scriptures they all so dearly love to quote.
Am missing everyone at ohih too. Hope you are doing ok. I did read your post at GM's. I too received an email reply today. My email addy is on my profile.
OMG, AP! You had me laughing so hard I ended up crying!
You know, I take real offense to people that twist the Bible to meet their own needs or desires. I believe that the Lord has called upon us to witness and that can't be done if you're being nasty and insulting people left and right, Lacy. Take the time to be gentle and genuine with your words. If you can't take that time, then stop talking altogether. First do no harm!
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